Official Luthiers Forum!

Okay, after a few emails to Paul Dempsey, I find out that the ASIA Guitarmaker Forum is truly operational. I know it was being tested soon after the new Website went up and was difficult to get logged on or even post.

Here is what I've learned in the last little bit. Guitarmaker Forum is indeed Operational. It's a part of the package for ASIA members, and every member is allowed to participate. I just posted in every category available.

To participate you become have to login which is fairly benign, except for the fact that your USERNAME is always your email address. And to facilitate logging in, I'm told that you need to login on the main page of www.guitarmaker.org (This is ASIA) Association of Stringed Instrument Artisans

Paul, thanks for taking the time to walk me through to understanding how to post on the forum. I have some emails from Paul I'd like to post verbatim, because he is good at explaining the site, heck, he built it.

Since I didn't get his permission to do that I'll simply paraphrase. Logging in from the main page is for ASIA members. If you go to the Forum and try to log on it won't work. That is only for Non-ASIA Members to be able to log in and post.

Non-ASIA members cannot start subtopics, only ASIA members. Go look, I started a subtopic in each of the five or so Topics currently started by the Forum Moderators. I think it's possible for several ASIA members to become moderators, if you are a member in good standing. Ask.

The system is basically a threaded format. You lose the use of your BACK button, and have to use the HOME or subtopic headings at the top of the pages to navigate.

I think it would be a great pat on the back to all involved in leading ASIA to go over, log on, and make a few posts. Thanks Paul Dempsey for making this tool accessible. Maybe we need to work up a page explaining the intricacies of the Forum to our members. I could just about compile it from the emails you sent me.

Paul told me that he is planning to add html capabilities soon. That will assist in adding pictures and links and such, which really adds interest to any forum. Can more than one luthier forum peacefully co-exist on this old planet. Sure it can.

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http://www.dickeyguitars.com

[QUOTE=Bruce Dickey]Can more than one luthier forum peacefully co-exist on this old planet. Sure it can.[/QUOTE]

That isn't the point I was trying to make.

What I was saying, was what is the differentiation of another forum? There are already lots of forums, for me at least, the question of what makes them unique is important.

Certainly we can peacefully co-exist with ASIA.   We love them.   

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Brock Poling
Columbus, Ohio
http://www.polingguitars.com

[QUOTE=Brock Poling] Certainly we can peacefully co-exist with ASIA.   We love them.    [/QUOTE]

Amen.

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http://www.dickeyguitars.com

Bruce,

     You've got to be one of the most impatient people I know, and unless you're volunteering to moderate, up-date, and otherwise oversee and manage that entire forum, try to hang on to your britches for a bit.

     Last year our main concern was to get the magazine and infrastructure back on track, and we seem to be in pretty good shape in that department now, so this year we plan to devote a lot more time to the web site, it's content, and the forum.

     Before everyone starts posting willy-nilly however, we need to recruit a site manager for general maintenance, and manager/moderators for the forum. We also need to decide how we're going to structure the whole thing - rules, etc.

     Hang in there. We'll get it going.

     Bill

Okay,

     Call me crazy if you will, I've been trying to figure out how to access the
new forum since it was created and I still cannot. No matter where I log in
from I don't get any further than a forum page that offers me the
opportunity to log in again. What gives?

Yuke

Bill, impatient? What are you talking about?

I haven't been talking to you, I've been talking to Paul Dempsey. That's who Brock said was in charge.

Paul didn't warn me not to use the Guitarmaker Forum. Matter of fact it was just the opposite. He helped me understand how to get onto and utilize the forum.

There are topics there even one you started. I simply followed the criteria Paul outlined for me and sure enough it is fully operational.

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http://www.dickeyguitars.com

Tried to login several times and no luck, I am sure it will work eventually, I mean we fix guitars we can do anything. Thank God for the OLF or I would have nowhere to type this message
Evan

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http://www.NewYorkGuitarRepair.com

Bruce,

     I log in at the ASIA home page go to the forum and only find the offer to
do a search, which seems to do nothing. I cannot find the topics you've
entered. There is no navigation that suggests any information exists. Can
you point me in the right direction?yukonarizona38770.6047569444

Woo Hoo I actually logged in
Evan

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http://www.NewYorkGuitarRepair.com

Evan, Did you try logging on from the Forum, that login is for non-ASIA members. ASIA members need to login from the front of the www.guitarmakers.org website according to Paul Dempsey.

Paul mentioned he might cross reference the two login positions later so that ASIA members can log on from either place. But for now you gotta log on from the main site to get in. Hey, if I did it, anyone can do it.

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http://www.dickeyguitars.com

I just reponded to one of Bruce's posts and it seemed to work! Eureka now I have another website to keep me from getting back to working on all these freaking guitars in my shop!!!
Evan

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http://www.NewYorkGuitarRepair.com

Eureka! After I logged in on the ASIA home page I then thought I'd try using
the front page search tool to look for the forum - so I entered the word
"forum." Voila! Is that really the way it's supposed to work? I'm as non-
intuitive as the next guy, but that seemed like a stretch.

Read my first post in this thread for starters.

You log in at the www.guitarmakers.org startpage, not at the forum.

You only log in at the forum if you are an non-member.

Use your mouse to highlight the topics and subtopics near the top of the page. Then you click on the subtopics that appear.

Also, another thing I learned in just the few minutes over there playing around. If you see a little box with a minus sign - or a + plus sign, that opens and closes the comments which are attached.

_________________
http://www.dickeyguitars.com

"Bill, impatient? What are you talking about?

I haven't been talking to you, I've been talking to Paul Dempsey. That's who Brock said was in charge.

Paul didn't warn me not to use the Guitarmaker Forum. Matter of fact it was just the opposite. He helped me understand how to get onto and utilize the forum."


     Gee Bruce... How do I put this? You seem to have misunderstood so much, that it's difficult for me to know where to start.

     1), You and I have addressed the forum issue before, and I've asked you to be patient. Now, you're all fired up to have people over there posting in it before we've decided how we want it run.

     2), You're talking to me now, and I've told Paul to take the Forum off line until I tell him otherwise. Not to sound too "all-powerful" but, that should answer the second half of your second sentence as well.

     3), Paul is the technical guru, that's why he was happy to explain the workings of the Forum - so that you could see how feature rich the programming is, but Paul doesn't set policy. I'm afraid that's my curse.

     Once again. We'll have the forum up and running as soon as we have moderators and managers to keep track of content and policies. Please be patient with us - it won't all happen at once.

     Thanks.

     Bill
Bill Moll38770.643900463

Hmm, sorry for stirrin' up the hive.
It seems what I'm experiencing may be a compatability problem - perhaps
it's the Emac/OSX/Safari versions that I'm runnung.
I'll stay away from the Forum 'til further notice.

[QUOTE=Bruce Dickey] Can more than one luthier forum peacefully co-exist on this old planet. Sure it can.[/QUOTE]

Maybe I was wrong.

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http://www.dickeyguitars.com

You were Bruce, but not in the way that you think you were wrong.

[QUOTE=Bill Moll] You were Bruce, but not in the way that you think you were wrong.[/QUOTE]

Huh? The all powerful OZ isn't making any sense.

My conversations with Paul Dempsey had nothing to do with you Bill. If we have had conversations before about the ASIA Forum I don't recall. Let's just leave it at that. Have a nice day.

And when you talk ugly to someone, putting a couple of smiley faces doesn't make up for the fact you were ugly to someone.

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http://www.dickeyguitars.com

    I'll have to fly with Bruce here. Bill, you were pretty fired up and came in with a chip on something. I have loads of friends who are ASIA members and have always asked me why I don't subscribe to a membership with either ASIA or GAL. Even though I hold many members of both organizations in the highest regard both personally and professionally, I've met too many who think that their membership to one, the other or both buys them some credibility...even though they are completely inexperienced and have very little practical knowledge of the craft of instrument building or repair.

   It's not a mambership certificate or a receipt for a year's dues that make you a luthier or sringed instrument artisan, but time and hard work and a steady willingness to humble yourself and learn from those around you. I'm sure Bruce was really just trying to do you a great service by getting others excited about the forum being active...not trying to jump the gun and make more work for you at all.

   People are passionate and excited about their endeavors in building instruments are most are very eager to meet others and share information and ideas in an effort to broaden the R&D base for all. Relax, and enjoy the excitement that exists for your forum before you've even gotten it up and running....I think you were a little confused on who was being impatient.

   Arrogance and inconsideration for others can swing a heavy stroke that is tough to erase with a feathery apology or a few smileys.

Enjoy the anticipation don't resent it and fan its flames with some kind words,
Kevin Gallagher/Omega GuitarsKevin Gallagher38771.7976041667

Hmmmmmm.... don't you think it's odd, advertising another guitar makers forum on a guitar makers forum.

I haven't seen to many people saying,

Hey y'all, theres the new XYZ guitar makers forum (stick in 13 fret, MIMF, luthierforum, ASIA, or other) online, lets all check it out.

No offense to anyone, but there is lots of good information already out there. Do we really need another luthiers forum? I know that the ASIA forum was probably around before the old OLF, but it for some reason wasn't getting the traffic that the OLF has.

Haven't you guys heard of the term Strategic Alliance? ASIA has made some sort of agreement with the OLF guys, why not collaborate on the forum as well, what a greater place this would be.

_________________
My Facebook Guitar Page

"There's really no wrong way, as long as the results are what's desired." Charles Fox

"We have to constantly remind ourselves what we're doing....No Luthier is putting a man on the moon!" Harry Fleishman

"Generosity is always different in the eye of the person who didn't receive anything, but who wanted some." Waddy Thomson

No, there's always room for another place, for avrious reasons. Sometimes a certain person may choose to not frequent a certain forum, for vaious reasons, but he/she will frequent another. Sometimes we get banned from one or the other... The atmosphere will be different at every one, also, lending to different ideas/thoughts being put forth. Stuff like that...

Some are geared more towards hobbiests/beginners, some more towards professionals. Some are simply advertisements for the forum owner's woods <bg>

But there's always room for more!

Ok. I have to chime in here..... this conversation has taken a bad turn and before we get too far afield I think I should make a few comments.

Rod, you are exactly right. While the OLF is VERY loose about what is acceptable subject matter, I do think it is a bit of an uncomfortable position for us to see another board promoted... even if it is from an organization that we love dearly.

As many of you know in addition to my role here at the OLF I am also the marketing director for ASIA. The OLF and ASIA have a very good working relationship and we want to do everything in our power to see them thrive, but frankly I have been talking to Bill about the very same question that Rod raises with respect to another forum -- "so what?"

I do not mean this in a cynical way. It is more of an internal challenge for us to figure out where the association can add something new, more, different to our members than what is already available from the MIMF, AG forum, 13th Fret, the OLF and any of the other sites out there.

I think that is a valid question and Bill and I have been batting some good ideas around about how ASIA can incorporate the interactive space to provide value to the membership.

Bill has been busting his hump to get ASIA up and running on all cylindars and he deserves a GIANT thank you for his efforts. For all of his talk about his staff and what I, Jim Samuel, Paul Dempsey, Nadine Nelson, and the rest of the gang are doing, make no mistake ... without Bill none of this would be happening.

We have big plans for ASIA. 2005 was about getting 4 magazines published, something that has previously been a challenge; the first part of 2006 is about rebuilding business processes and infrastructure, and then we are looking at new strategic ideas to bring more value to our members.

I understand that this thread started as an enthusiastic attempt to support something ASIA is doing. That is clearly recognized and deeply appreciated. Just give us a little time. Something good is coming, we are just not quite ready to talk about it yet.

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Brock Poling
Columbus, Ohio
http://www.polingguitars.com

Well said Mario, case in point I've noticed you are less grumpy and opinionated on this forum <bg> Maybe I'll find one where you are a pussycat <BBBBG>

Mario is one of the kindest guys i have met in person on this planet, down to earth and very generous and patient. The forums must provide him a way to release some grumpyness from time to time but i'm sure he laughs his head off at newbs like me when he reads the silliness of some of my not so thought through comments and think: Wake up Serge or i'll smack ya behind the head!

Mario, you rock hard!

[QUOTE=Brock Poling]
Bill has been busting his hump to get ASIA up and running on all cylindars and he deserves a GIANT thank you for his efforts. For all of his talk about his staff and what I, Jim Samuel, Paul Dempsey, Nadine Nelson, and the rest of the gang are doing, make no mistake ... without Bill none of this would be happening.[/QUOTE]

And, I think, people should be reminded that you folks are all doing this on a volunteer basis, correct? You all deserve a big "tip of the hat!"

I'd just like to put forth the gentle reminder, though, that people become frustrated when, even after patiently waiting for some time, a promise isn't kept. Imagine, please, how someone might feel when he periodically attempts to access the new ASIA forum over the course of almost a year, and virtually nothing has changed. No access, no messages, no real explanation of what's going on. These are people who, whether new or returning members, are excited about ASIA's rebirth and are eager to participate in its benefits. I think virtually all of them would understand delays or changes in focus if they had some current feedback about what is happening. Might I suggest--while you're determining how things will take shape, turn the forum into a one-(or two)-topic "Letters to/from ASIA" page. It would give members a chance to ask questions about the Association, and to pat you on the back or make suggestions concerning your efforts for all things ASIA; and, it would give you (i.e. the main movers/shakers) an opportunity to respond to questions, ask questions of your own, and to alert the membership about ASIA issues. Make sure your site links work intuitively, and you're golden! If the forum software is just too convoluted/complex at this time to do that, how about a weekly update on the homepage?

ASIA volunteers have done a mighty fine job so far, and members are on your side. Let them know what's happening at any given time, and they'll be happy!